Great thread ATJ. I had never read anything about your past. It’s interesting to read about your reaction to 9/11. I was one who’s faith was strengthened during that time. I remember all of the grandiose rhetoric about how this system could not possibly last more than a year or so. I believed it. As the months turned into years, and 9/11 began to fade into the past, I finally began to realize the irrationality and childishness of JW’s clinging onto each world event as though it was finally going to be the final straw that broke this system’s back. I began to realize that Watchtower ideology was like a broken down slot machine. No matter how much you believe, and how many times you pull the lever, no pay off was going to come.
Jeremy C
JoinedPosts by Jeremy C
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Tuesday, September 11, 2001 - The Day My JW Faith Began to Die (finally)
by AllTimeJeff init was late june of 2001 that i was appointed as an elder at the amazingly seasoned age of 26. a true lifelong goal had been achieved.
i had to be appointed an elder before 30. already, peers were starting to be appointed.
i had to make it.
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My Father passed away during the night
by jwfacts indad was a great man, great, despite the religion.
he was powerful, tall and intelligent, yet humble and kind.
he was an introvert, and a circuit overseer.
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Jeremy C
Paul:
I haven’t been on here in a few days and just saw this thread. I’m so sorry. I lost my father almost two years ago, and it was very difficult. From what you described, your father sounded like a gentle soul. Take care.
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R.I.P George
by fade_away inif it wasn't an extremely late (or extremely early) april fools joke, our friend no room for george seems to have departed......from this website.
apparently falling victim to a devastating love bomb that claimed his ability of thinking for himself and his freedom of heart, mind, body and soul.
i was wondering if maybe in the future he will be on the convention stage in front of a couple thousand people talking about his "experience".
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Jeremy C
Or better yet, throwing the whole laptop in the trash. Isn't that what the illustrations always show?....The throwing away of expensive belongings?
LMAO!!! fade_away, I can remember watching many of those dramas when I was a child: the sweet innocent sister who throws away a short skirt, or the Ministerial Servant who is congratulated by an elder for throwing his AC/DC records into the trash. The dramas always paralleled some story in the Old Testament, such as Samuel or Jeremiah keeping Jehovah’s temple clean.
No Room For George better throw away his computer after this, as it could be likened to meat that was sacrificed to idols.
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Confusing messages at DC
by Kensho inokay i know everyone has probably already attended the dc and have posted their experiences here, but i just went to fri. and sat.
session (with a drama although timely for families i thought would never end) and a couple of bizarre things stood out.. very poor attempt at explaining the overlapping gen. new light.
during the brother's talk he said" there are two phases to the overlapping generations".
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Jeremy C
before the congregation, they will say should we give this outstanding balance to Head Quarters and everyone will applaud with approval.
LOL, thetrueone, you reminded me of when the congregations would pass these kinds of resolutions during the Service Meeting. Every single vote was always 98-0 or 115-0, with no dissenters. Thinking back now, it reminds me of when Saddam Hussein used to brag about his government being democratic because he had a parliament that voted on legislation. It’s quite peculiar that whenever the democracy-loving Saddam put forth a policy, the votes in favor of it were always 250-0.
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Confusing messages at DC
by Kensho inokay i know everyone has probably already attended the dc and have posted their experiences here, but i just went to fri. and sat.
session (with a drama although timely for families i thought would never end) and a couple of bizarre things stood out.. very poor attempt at explaining the overlapping gen. new light.
during the brother's talk he said" there are two phases to the overlapping generations".
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Jeremy C
On the subject of paying down credit cards:
The men in leadership are completely out of touch with the many reasons as to why people have credit cards. Almost none of the Governing Body members know what it’s like to have to pay for rent, healthcare, car repairs, and groceries. Of those that did have secular jobs, those jobs were decades ago when the economy was radically different.
All they need to do is spend fifteen minutes on CNN Money or Bloomberg.com reading about the current economy to understand why current trends are the way they are. Economists have already discussed at great length the trends regarding the use of credit cards. Contrary to popular myths, people most often use credit cards for emergency expenses that they can’t afford: unexpected car repairs, an emergency room visit for their child, etc.
The Watchtower leaders are profoundly out of touch with reality and the modern day economy. People who have been convinced that college is a waste of time cannot find jobs that pay enough to be able to afford all of life’s necessities. Guess what has to fill in the gap? Credit.
I cannot believe the sheer stupidity of these men. Someone needs to sit them down and give them a rudimentary economics lesson. And while they’re at it, hand them a copy of “Logical Fallacies for Dummies”.
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Would you go back if you thought there were one in a million chances you were wrong?
by Paul Duda inoften i wake up in a cold sweat wondering if i'm wrong.
life is short.
i have only a brief time to make a decision.
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Jeremy C
Paul Duda:
What you are going through is completely normal. Trust me, I’ve been there. I know all about the doubts and the second guessing. I too used to wake up early in the morning with horrible anxiety. Sometimes, I couldn’t eat. It got so bad, I even thought about suicide!
I left the organization right before the District Convention theme came out: “Deliverance At Hand” and the world-wide Kingdom News tract declaring judgment on Babylon the Great was announced. When this happened, I went through horrible anxiety and fear. I asked “what if they’re right?” It was a roller coaster of emotions to say the least.
The one thing that kept me from going back was that I had already done a lot of research into the book of Genesis. I knew one thing unequivocally: humans had been on earth longer than 6,000 years and the Garden of Eden never happened. Think about it: without the Garden of Eden account, the entire JW doctrinal structure collapses. So does the very reason for mankind’s need for salvation! That was the one thing that told me that their doctrinal structure was full of holes. And if their doctrinal structure was so vulnerable and weak, then so was their conception of God.
Here is what broke the fear for me: first I found some people who had been out for a long time, and talked on the phone regularly. When I first left, I talked on the phone with two ex-Elders and an ex-Circuit Overseer. They gave me a sense of clarity that I could not have gotten on my own. Second, I read Ray Franz’s book: In Search of Christian Freedom. This book blew away the Watchtower doctrines, and finally made me 100% convinced that the JWs don’t have the truth.
Today, I am 150% convinced that the JWs don’t have the truth. I know without a single doubt that I made the right decision. Even if I thought they might be right, I still wouldn’t return. I would rather die along with people like the Dalai Lama, than to serve a jealous, petty, psychopathic, mass-murdering god that the Watchtower worships.
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"THEY" are here right now. I don't want them to come around again, ever!!
by trailerfitter inokay ,, this is a question and a confession.
we have had an issue come to a head in this household of mine.
after getting to the bottom of my parners intentions i have given her an ultimatum knowing all too well she will choose the jws over myself and family.
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Jeremy C
Trailerfitter:
I know others have mentioned it, but I will add to one point. I know it’s difficult right now, but you need to do your very best to try to keep cool, and really watch what you say. Any verbal attacks leveled at the group only reinforce your wife’s beliefs that the Jehovah’s Witnesses have the truth.
Jehovah’s Witnesses teach new recruits that any opposition from family is evidence that Satan is trying to break their faith. This especially applies to unbelieving spouses such as yourself. I think the wise thing to do is not try to make the custody of your son an issue right now. The chances of your son ever needing a blood transfusion are statistically very slim. However, if it were to come up, many judges are very sympathetic to people like you. The media is on your side as well.
Don’t take any actions or say things that will make your wife believe that she is being “persecuted”. Jehovah’s Witnesses will only use that as ammunition against you, and then will say “but, look at how loving all of us are to you”.
You can in a kind way let her know that you have strong concerns and see teachings of theirs that are false. If you can do this in a kind, gentle way – demonstrating concern; you just might get her to listen to you a little bit.
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School for Congregation Elders
by C.O.B.E.Beef ini attended the school late last year, and it was an emotional and mental rollercoaster for me.
i was already divided in my heart to say the least.
one of the instructors stayed in my home for the week, and my family genuinely enjoyed his company.
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Jeremy C
In regards to the hierarchy that was written on the board, I can recall this kind of sentiment expressed at Bethel on numerous occasions. I can tell you that there is a sense of pride that exists among rank & file Bethelites at giving unwavering allegiance to men. When I was going through my orientations, another new Bethelite and I were sitting in the office of a very prominent brother who is now on the U.S. Branch Committee. I will leave out his name. He was speaking to us about loyalty to the faithful slave. He related that he loved music by Pavarotti. He went on to say that if the brothers told him he could no longer listen to Pavarotti, that he would gladly throw it all into the trash. At the time, I thought that he was a fine example of spirituality. Now I look back and shudder to think that a man like this now has one of the most powerful positions in the organization.
There is an atmosphere of what I call “consensual stupidity” within the organization. Jehovah’s Witnesses are actually conditioned to view themselves as “spiritual” if they are willing to NOT think, and blindly follow orders. Complete compliance with a lack of critical thinking is considered praiseworthy in the organization. All we have to do is look at history to see that no society like this can flourish forever. Just like Soviet Union, they will eventually have to face a collision course with reality.
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Earthquake at Bethel...mysterious Bethelite speaks up on significant concerns at world headquarters .
by koolaid-man ini know this post will bring out all those who love to criticise and rebut.
the following information is timely and very plausible.
in view of recent posts and special announcements to be taking place in the organization i found the following to have credibility.
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Jeremy C
If it's been demonstrated that these posts by kool-aide man are fraudulent, then I would recommend that for the simple credibility of this forum, Rick Fearon be banned. I don’t see how tolerance for varying viewpoints constitutes tolerance for spreading lies and disinformation by a cut-rate con artist. Just my personal opinion.
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Why JWs Often Have a Hard Time Thinking For Themselves
by Jeremy C intoday, cedars had a really good post on a questions from readers article in which the watchtower instructs jws to consult the watchtower library index when they have questions on personal matters.
the watchtower article explained that the branch cannot answer all personal inquiries that come into their offices.
this post got me thinking about an area that i gave a lot of thought to prior to; and after leaving the organization.
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Jeremy C
No wonder the majority of JWs do not have a college education - if they did, they'd have the critical thinking skills necessary to see what a load of BS the WT has been feeding them all this time.
It seems that most young JWs who get a college education do begin to see through the Watchtower rhetoric, but not all of them. I have known many JWs who became highly educated and earned advanced degrees while remaining just as devoted to the Watchtower as anyone. I’ve also known some people who dropped out of high school, yet were still honest-minded enough to be able to pick apart the fallacies of Watchtower doctrines.
This is why I’ve come to believe that devotion to the Watchtower is much more emotional than it is intellectual. I was having a long conversation about this with another ex-JW yesterday. We both agreed that Watchtower teachings do provide comfort and certainty to those who emotionally cannot handle living with the ambiguities and “gray areas” of life. What exactly happens after we die? Many people cannot live peacefully with this being an open-ended question. Many people need to have black and white answers; and not only on the big life and death issues of life, but also on the minor things – such as whether God approves of them sending someone a birthday card, or whether they should watch an “R” rated movie.
When you look at many long time prison inmates who deliberately commit crime to go back into prison because it is more comfortable than the “outside”, the emotional dynamics of Jehovah’s Witnesses begins to make much more sense.